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 We are all children of Adam and Eve

 Author:  Topic:  Posted:
Sep 26, 2001
We are all children of Adam and Eve. I read this line while catching up on World Trade Center news, and it struck a resonant chord within me.

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Adam Rightmann

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I was reading about the World Trade Center tragedy, and a columnist noted that we are all children of Adam and Eve. What a profound statement, the civilized world does all pray to the same God, the God that created Adam and Eve, the God the freed Moses. True, the major religions of the world mainly differ in how they treat our Saviour, Jesus Christ.a The Jews barely acknowledge his existence, while the Muslins consider Him a prophet. But aside from those major heresies, we all consider the Old Testament to be God's word.

So I am asking all our adequacy readers to reflect upon this before acting. That turban wearing Sikh you want to pelt with bricks and rocks probably had nothing to do with bombing, and he believes in Adam, Eve, Abraham, Moses, Noah and the whole Old Testament. The mosque you wish to firebomb is full of people praying to our God, the father of our Saviour. The Jews you wish to blame for this mess created the foundation of Christianity, and can still be converted. Until we're all members of the one true Church, I wish you all peace.

[editor's note, by jsm]

Sadly, of course, although admirable in his sentiments, my esteemed co-editor Mr Rightmann is not quite correct in his assessment. Although most major religions of the world (Christianity, Buddhism, Hindoo, Scientology, Islam) recognise the divinity (or at least, the special status) of Jesus Christ and his Holy Mother, there is one group who do not.

I'm talking about, of course, Pagans.

Pagans, or "Goths" to give them their correct name, believe in all manner of strange spirits. They are happy to believe in faeries, tree spirits, racially dubious Allfather figures and such like with no real evidence at all, but not in the undeniable historical fact of the existence of Jesus Christ of Nazareth. Although it is perhaps uncomfortable to say it, the normal patriotic citizen of the USA actually has more in common, spiritually, with Osama Bin Laden than with his pasty-faced, leftivist, draft-dodging Goth classmate.

Based on this, I have a suggestion.

One of the beliefs of the Pagan tradition is in the concept of a "scapegoat". This is an innocent creature (historically an actual goat), which is ritually blamed for all the sins of a village or "coven". After having taken responsibility for the sins of the group, the goat is ritually slaughtered (or for PETA Pagans, driven out of town in a humane, non-coercive manner). This purges the sins and troubles of the community and allows the group to make a fresh start.

I think you can see where this is headed. What the world of the Christo-Judaico-Muslimic tradition desperately needs is a new start, a chance to put aside the bad blood and misunderstandings that have dogged our great faiths. Meanwhile,

  • The Pagans have no responsibility for the current crisis (they are innocent animals, rather like the goat),
  • This makes them ideally suited to bear the weight of the sins of the people who actually were responsible, and
  • They clearly have no religious or ethical objections to the concept of scapegoating.
It's obvious.

I am proposing that the Goths be made scapegoats for the World Trade Center attacks.

Instead of declaring war on Afghanistan, the USA should declare war on domestic Goths. Instead of declaring jihad against the great Satan of capitalism, the Islamicists should be encouraged to concentrate their fire on Austria, historical home of the Goths. The Indians, Pakistanis and Chinese don't actually have all that many Goths or pagans domestically, but they can pitch in if they want to. Maybe they can start a persecution of their own native animist cultures, the nearest thing they have to Pagans.

We must begin the "witch hunt" now. It is the only way for the healing to begin.


Kill everyone (none / 0) (#11)
by nobbystyles on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 05:33:39 AM PST
Just kill everyone then there will be finally peace in the world. Imagine a world without injustice, hatred, racism, exploitation and unbelievers. Easy if the human race commits mass suicide. The terrorists have shown us the way...

Great idea! (none / 0) (#13)
by Well Adjusted Individual on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 06:06:12 AM PST
That sir, is a GREAT idea - especially letting all the god-less people of the world kill themselves while the glorious nation of the United States waits in the wings.

When everybody's dead WE WILL RULE THE WORLD! No true american will die in the conflict of course so we will be - under the hand of Rev. Falwell the rulers of the world! We could convert all nations to our wholesome christian beliefs and sit together at the table of brotherhood along with all our other christian brothers.

Yes, it would be a truly wonderful world!
-- May the lord strike down those who are not rightous.

The US is populated only by the god-ful? (none / 0) (#34)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 01:08:08 PM PST
Do you mean to suggest that all the citizens of the glorious US are god-fearing, right-living Christian faithful? Cause speaking for the bulk of America, I can tell you that we are a primarily secularized, materially acquisitive, highly competitive bunch of right capitalists. If we were all keep-to-ourselves, barn-raising, carriage-driving, no-button-wearing Quakers, we wouldn't have commercial jetliners or buildings tall enough to fly them into, and this wouldn't be very much of a discussion.

I think for the most part Americans have made their preferences known, and we generally would rather enjoy the here and now than piously wait for the hereafter. Personally, I never felt better than when I took my tithe and spent that hour on Sunday at the local gentleman's club. I don't feel too bad about it. Since I'm giving the money to my bishop's daughter instead, at least the money is staying in the ward.

"God wants Crusade, God wants Jihad, God wants good, God wants bad.
What God wants, God gets god help us all."
-Roger Waters

I strongly protest the hijacking of my article (5.00 / 4) (#15)
by Adam Rightmann on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 06:51:44 AM PST
I spend countless hours creating. editing and perfecting each article, honing each nuance, and to have it taken over by adequacy's village idiot to further his own agenda is a slap in the face.

For the record, pagans in the United States, while definitely being an affront to any right thinking Christian, are relatively harmless, spoiled, upper middle class children revolting against their parents' mores. Perhaps in the UK, with it's remnants of the subhuman Celtic races still lurking in Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Cornwall, pagans may be more of threat (the film Burning Man certainly seems to indicate so), but I doubt it. Convert the muslims first, then worry about burning the Pagans.

A. Rightmann

Dancing (0.00 / 2) (#26)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 11:56:03 AM PST
I doubt u spend more than 10 minutes in actual writing/editing etc.

Good work, nonetheless, but as others have pointed out: sloppy.

I'm no one to say as I value grammer as much as your morales.

Irregardless, this is obviously a lovers tat between u and jsm. Please leave the pillow talk and squabbles in the bedroom.

Jesus Is Homoerotic,


What are you complaining about (none / 0) (#28)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 11:58:13 AM PST
For the first time ever, jsm has done something to *improve* the quality of this site

Doubt (1.00 / 3) (#39)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu Sep 27th, 2001 at 07:24:36 AM PST
This is a 10 minute article. To write/edit & post.

Still nice tho, if quaint.

Why don't you and jism, i mean jsm, just make up: set an example for us all through your understanding, and all that trite nonsense.

Anyways, Why not just kill all but perhaps 300,000 people. Thereby having enough people to repopulate the world in ur own image.


ken-ken? Wasn't that a Pokemon? (4.50 / 4) (#43)
by otak on Thu Sep 27th, 2001 at 09:48:21 AM PST
Why don't you and jism
Now hang on a minute sir! You appear to have mis-spelled the name of one of adequacy's fine upstanding editors.
i mean jsm
But wait! Now I understand! The altering of jsm's name was with humourous intent! My knees are weak. Oh my sides. Such a subtle and multi-layered piece of wit must have required many hours of work on your part. For your efforts, sir, I salute you!

Dancing Witrh The Darkness (0.00 / 1) (#46)
by Anonymous Reader on Fri Sep 28th, 2001 at 06:02:25 AM PST
truly? oh dear sir, you are most kind.

After hours of labour to find humourous content, and much failure in doing so, i noticed the unique fashion in which jism's {some claim it is jsm, but we shall never know for certain} sprayed or splurted his opinions unto the columns of others.

Nothing inherently wrong it that, but it did put me into a certain mindset about his name.

A. Rightman cannot, however, be placed above jsm in this matter. 2 to tango and all that. And interesting note of Adolf Rightman, tho, is his compulsion to "instruct and guide." I wonder if his calling is boyscout master, and if so, which state authorities to notify.

Irregardles, they sqaubble like little sisters, or a lover's tat. I have critizied them for this before, but overall it is a nice distraction and a source of pleasure. So I'll let them rest.

I would enjoy a "Kill Yr Idols" special on the two of them: how they met, where they were married, and so on.

If Peter reads this {and doesn't delete it} maybe he can get it written. Now that would be superb.

Until then,
I am Ur undying Pokemon Servant,
Ken-Ken Kenny

Backwards (none / 0) (#16)
by westgeof on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 08:34:33 AM PST
Religion in general is the enemy. Countless atrocities are commited in the name of some 'god' or another. The really ironic part is that they think they are killing people that god wants to die. If that's true then why doesn't it kill them itself? Bah. Religion was a tool for controling the masses in the past, we've outgrown it and should look for truth, not mythology.
I say burn all the religious leaders. The pagans are harmless, at least they don't brainwash our children. I feel sorry for the mothers of all these suicide bombers. They lost their children to religion, and that religion took their lives.

As a child I wanted to know everything. Now I miss my ignorance.

Dancing (1.00 / 2) (#29)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 11:59:37 AM PST
Come on now.

Religion is not bad. It gives men, otherwise lacking, a crutch on which to stand and plod forward. Moreoever, it makes people happy. And for that, it is praised.

But like any thing used by man, it can be a weapon.

Guns Don't Kill People
I Kill People

Personal Responisbily, Where Art Thou?,


guns don't kill people (none / 0) (#50)
by Anonymous Reader on Sat Sep 29th, 2001 at 08:32:09 AM PST
guns don't kill people...people kill people!
and you better learn that if you expect to ever be any good at killing people, mister!


Burnism (none / 0) (#51)
by Anonymous Reader on Sat Sep 29th, 2001 at 08:37:54 AM PST
>If that's true then why doesn't it kill them >itself?

The Lord works in mysterious ways. Didn't you get the memo ?

>Bah. Religion was a tool for controling the >masses in the past, we've outgrown

Agreed. We are in the 21st century! We need new and more sophisticated tools for controlling our masses! ( may I suggest napalm ? )

>I say burn all the religious leaders.

Here, here !(may I sugest napalm again?)
Let's call that "burnism" and make a religion out of it.

>The pagans are harmless, at least they don't >brainwash our children.



Ignorance on parade (5.00 / 2) (#17)
by Dexter Descarte on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 09:38:16 AM PST
Firstly, Sikhs most certainly do not believe the Old Testement is the word of God. Read your own links for Mithra's sake.

"All the Vedas, the religious books of the Muslims, the Simirtis and Shashtras, by reading these, salvation is not obtained. He who by Guru's instruction utters the one Name; He gathers the pure glory." (Guru Arjan Dev, Suhi, pg. 747)

Secondly, the scapegoat is a Jewish tradition.

Scapegoat: When the 2nd Temple was built (500 BCE), Yom Kippur was primarily a priestly holiday. Very elaborate rites were used by the Chief Priest of Zadok including that of the "azazel goat". It this instance, the sins of the congregation were symbolically placed as a red sash on a designated goat which was later driven out into the wilderness. A second goat was sacrificed to Yahweh.

Research is not a bad word.

I thank you (5.00 / 2) (#19)
by Adam Rightmann on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 10:18:18 AM PST
I too was aware of the Jewish foundations of the term scapegoat but did not want to mention them for fear of seeming a small minded vengeful sort, eager to parade the pitiful ignorance of my esteemed colleague and editor, jsm. Thanks to your exposing the limits of his meagre knowledge, I no longer have to.

A. Rightmann

Must resist (3.50 / 2) (#33)
by Dexter Descarte on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 12:51:02 PM PST
...for fear of seeming a small minded vengeful sort...

It's hard to lay off of a strait line like that, but my willpower is strong and my pith level is low.

sometimes this site digusts me (2.00 / 1) (#21)
by jsm on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 10:32:09 AM PST
Are you seriously suggesting that the Jewish people be made scapegoats for this atrocity? After all they have suffered in the last hundred years? We have a strict non-censorship policy here at (apart from trolls), but when faced with naked Anti-Semitism like yours, I must confess to being sorely tempted.

Fact: 6 million Jews were murdered in the 20th century, for their religion.

Fact: Less than 100 Goths were murdered during the same period for their religion.

And from these undeniable historial facts you deduce that it should be the poor old Jews in the firing line again?

Beyond belief.

... the worst tempered and least consistent of the editors
... now also Legal department and general counsel,

Compromise (3.33 / 3) (#25)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 11:51:49 AM PST
Very well. Then we shall take a "per capita" of goths equivalant to the jews dead in 20th century. However, at least one person of jewish descent or otherwise converted (by force if no jew can be found) shall be made to suffer.

One musn't break with tradition.

Further, how long has it been since catholics and their protestant conterparts have been persecuted? Far too long. We shall therefore, add perhaps 3 to 4 hundred to the total tally.

And forget you not muslims. I have always believed in a far distribution of all things. Therefore, as muslims & buddhists outnumber other faiths world-wide, we shall add perhaps 9 hundred to 1,200 muslims & buddhists (each) to our calculations.

All in all, the gene pool is much improved, as athiests and agnostics (clearly secular and seperate from this obvious "faith-based" initaitive, shall go about the repopulation.

Oh, btw, would A. Rightman be the bitch?



This site always disgusts me (2.00 / 1) (#30)
by Dexter Descarte on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 12:11:42 PM PST
Are you seriously suggesting that the Jewish people be made scapegoats for this atrocity?

Uh, no.

We have a strict non-censorship policy here at (apart from trolls), but when faced with naked Anti-Semitism like yours, I must confess to being sorely tempted.

You see, pointing out a glaring, idiotic error does not mean that the corrected error should be subjected to the same moronic logic of the original.

Fact: 6 million Jews were murdered in the 20th century, for their religion.

True, if simplistic.

Fact: Less than 100 Goths were murdered during the same period for their religion.

You got resources to back that up? If by 'Goth' you mean polytheist, I would hazard to guess your numbers are very, very low.

And from these undeniable historial facts you deduce that it should be the poor old Jews in the firing line again?

I certainly did not deduce nor imply any such thing. That you infered such is most definately not my problem.

Beyond belief.

I'll say.

indeed (none / 0) (#36)
by cp on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 01:34:20 PM PST
You got resources to back that up? If by 'Goth' you mean polytheist, I would hazard to guess your numbers are very, very low.
The numbers are even lower if by 'Goth' he means 'Cambodian'. By my count, over two million Goths died during the Killing Fields period of the latter half of the 1970s alone.

lie/misstatement. (4.00 / 1) (#41)
by alprazolam on Thu Sep 27th, 2001 at 08:59:06 AM PST
Fact: 6 million Jews were murdered in the 20th century, for their religion.

Entirely untrue. They were murdered for their race.

In addition it needs to be pointed out that roughly 3 million Palestinians have forced to become refugees since the Israeli occupation, with tens, if not hundreds of thousands being killed. Not the same order of magnitude perhaps of the holocaust, but striking nonetheless.

Support for this: (5.00 / 3) (#44)
by elenchos on Thu Sep 27th, 2001 at 11:43:25 AM PST
The Nazis sought out Jews who had converted to Christianity in order to exterminate them, making no distinction between religious Jews and those of Jewish descent, without regard to what religion they professed. Even Jews whose ancestors had converted generations in the past were searched out, because of their race alone.

Priests and ministers were requested to turn over their records to assist the Nazis in discovering Christians whose ancestors were Jewish, and they almost without exeption cheerfully complied, in direct contradiction to not only basic human morality, but also to the explictly understood Christian idea of conversion. By contrast, when the Nazis announced that they would be forcing those with genetic diseases or other undesirable traits (as defined by Nazi biology) to have abortions and be sterelized, the courageous outcry from Christian religous leaders was strong enough to generate the public will needed to stop the Nazi government in its tracks, thus preventing the euthenasia program from actually being carried out.

The whole episode sort of makes you wonder if Christianity is capable of instilling any moral virtue whatsoever in its followers. The evidence seems to indicate that amoral opportunism and blind prejudice (see also Jerry Falwell's recent remarks) rule the typical Christian mind.

But maybe I'm just being a little too negative, I don't know.

I do, I do, I do
--Bikini Kill

dysgenics (none / 0) (#49)
by Anonymous Reader on Fri Sep 28th, 2001 at 10:40:46 AM PST
This all comes into focus if one sees what Christianity holds dear. The Jews, with their usually high IQs and good social status, are an eugenic force, and therefore not under the protection of the church. Christianity is a disgenic religion that praises and protects mediocrity, hence their love for the mindless, the senseless, the weak, the meek, the stupid. Hardly ever a word of praise for intelligence or strength in the Good Book.
The retards, the handicapped, the sick, however, these are the kind of dead weight that the Church naturaly feels inclined to protect.
So what you describe is not really out of character, or surprising.
Has anybody ever noticed how the media is allways fearfull of the "supermen" that might be created by genetics, but never afraid of the creation, lets say, of a race of sub-humans (except so far as they might be "opressed")? I, for one, would gladly give my son the oportunity to be born better, stronger, more inteligent than me. But I guess that's not pious enough.


goths (none / 0) (#52)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Oct 3rd, 2001 at 01:07:11 PM PST
goths are not pagans-pagans are not goths. being a goth is wearing all black and liking heavy metal music. being pagan is celebrating the world for being a wonderful place. being a goth is being full of hate. being pagan is being full of happiness and love

Point of fact (5.00 / 2) (#22)
by chloedancer on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 10:34:47 AM PST
The inadvertent author stated that the concept of the scapegoat was embraced by Pagans as a tradition and did not, in fact, cite this particular ritual as having originated within the Pagan community. Keeping in mind the amount of "borrowing" present in the origins of Christianity, the concept of "scapegoating" might best be chalked up to collective consciousness.

Facts (5.00 / 3) (#31)
by Dexter Descarte on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 12:25:28 PM PST
Jungian theory aside, the ritual actually did originate amongst pagans, the pre-Yahweh hebrew pantheistic cults. That is why it is mentioned as the Azazel (a God) Goat. The tradition however is a Jewish one from which it was passed on to Christianity. It's first appearences in english date from the Elizibethian era long after paganism had been destroyed as an influence on western history. This can be easily correlated with the production of the King James Bible.

Placing the burden of sin on an animal or inanimate object is most certainly a near universal, but this particular form is purely semitic.

actually (none / 0) (#48)
by Anonymous Reader on Fri Sep 28th, 2001 at 10:29:00 AM PST
Actually, there was a version of "scapegoating" going on around the ancient Greeks. As I recall they would democratically choose one citizen to be arbitrarily ostracized from the city, which was a terrible punishment. This was called "pharmakos", from which words like "pharmacy" arise, and it was seen as a necessary healing process.
I point out that usually they chose the best amongst them ( like a far too proeminent general, for instance ), which smells of the typical leveling spirit of the "democrapic" mob, leaving me to confirm my instinct that democracy is the process by which one selects for the safety of mediocrity.


No really (none / 0) (#59)
by Dexter Descarte on Thu Oct 11th, 2001 at 08:49:14 AM PST
The term was ostrakophoria, from the name of the voting chit ostrakon, and it resulted in banishment for ten (later five) years. I can find no reference to it being a 'scapegoat' rather than a purely political action aimed at preventing tyranny (in 417 Hyperbolos was ostracised for his 'degeneracy', the only Athenian ostracised for non political reasons) nor do I find the word pharmakos associated with it at all (Pharmakon means both remedy and poison, and in ancient Greek it also means to paint with an arti-ficial color, a chemical dye, that imitates nature). Other than Athens only Argos, Milesia, and Meagara practised ostracism.

Aristotle (Athenaion Politeia 22.3) mentions it thusly: It had been passed from a suspicion of those in power, because Piesistratos had started as leader of the people and strategos, and became tyrant. The first to be ostracised was one of his relations, Hipparchos the son of Charmos, of Kollytos; it was the desire to expel him which was the primary motive of Kleisthenes in proposing the law.

Your critique of pure democracy is right on however. Just look up the life of Alcibiades (ostracised in 460) for confirmation of your instincts.

In some strange way, this makes sense to me. (5.00 / 1) (#18)
by chloedancer on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 10:10:36 AM PST
In general, I've long believed that the U.S.A. would benefit from returning to its stance of isolationism. And we have a history of persecuting our own, so it wouldn't be anything new, per se. Why strike out against a distant enemy when there are so many convenient symbolic substitutes close at hand? Just think of the economic gain to be realized! (Or would we be exporting Goths to the Chinese and Pakistanis in this scenario? It would be a boost to the airlines industry if we had to make 'em travel abroad to partake, after all...)

It would also give our naturalized citizenship a way to participate in the doctrine of nationalism that includes the principle of uniting against a common enemy, especially since the demons of their heritage may not have chosen to relocate with them. To wit:

One question that has always intrigued me is what happens to demonic beings when immigrants move from their homelands. Irish-Americans remember the fairies, Norwegian-Americans the nisser, Greek-Americans the vrykˇlakas, but only in relation to events remembered in the Old Country. When I once asked why such demons are not seen in America, my informants giggled confusedly and said "They're scared to pass the ocean, it's too far," pointing out that Christ and the apostles never came to America.
-- Richard Dorson, "A Theory for American Folklore", American Folklore and the Historian; University of Chicago Press (1971). (Credit also to Neil Gaiman, also, for using this quote to serve as the prologue to his recent novel, American Gods.)

In keeping with the religious theme, several Goths profess devotion to Lilith. With her multitude of Panic/Dionysian qualities, the tie-in to the role of "scapegoat" is reinforced yet again.

Finally, in this age of "Politically Correct" rhetoric, we'd be giving a voice and place to the disenfranchised among our ranks -- those who couldn't bring their demons with them, as well as those who live in the shadows of the mainstream... Try as I might, I cannot find fault with the proposition at hand.

Hey, it works for me. Reach out and deliver a love-tap to a Goth in the name of patriotism today!

Religion (none / 0) (#20)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 10:24:03 AM PST
You seem to have ignored the large atheist contingent.

Shush (2.00 / 2) (#27)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 11:57:34 AM PST
Hush up, you!

This is clearly a "faith-based" iniative.


Oh, this is just TOO perfect... (4.50 / 2) (#35)
by chloedancer on Wed Sep 26th, 2001 at 01:09:44 PM PST
I must confess that I left one crucial element out of my original post -- taking into consideration that whole "Goth death fetish" thing! By making them the world's scapegoats (including the ritual of slaughter), we'd actually be fulfilling one of their most cherished sacraments!

I even know our first target for bombing... there's this self-styled Church in New Orleans known as Westgate -- also known as The House of Death. They profess to be "in love with Death... Death the Entity, the Angel of Death, Azrael... the Great Separator of the soul from the flesh." We would be enabling those in residence to finally realize Azrael's embrace! Westgate, and its inhabitants, can serve as "ground zero" in our effort to restore harmony to the world at large! I'm sure the neighbors would all immediately sing our praises as heroic patriots, too (there'd be an immediate warm & fuzzy response)!

Can't you just feel the synchronicity?

We are NOT all created from Adam and Eve (5.00 / 1) (#38)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu Sep 27th, 2001 at 06:13:55 AM PST
GENESIS 1:26-27
   And God said, Let us make MAN in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon earth.

   So God created MAN in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

   This was on the SIXTH day, and on the seventh day God rested.

What about Adam and Eve? THEY HAD NOT YET BEEN CREATED! What is this lie that we all came from Adam and Eve? If you believe that the Bible is the word of God then it is obvious that there was a Pre-Adamic creation. Of course there are many so-called Christians out there who profess to believe in the Holy Scripture and Jesus Christ, but they only believe in selected portions, the bits which it suits them to believe. These are the HYPOCRITES and they are even worse than liars and thieves.

   And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and man became a living soul.

   And the Lord God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.

The man ADAM, and he put him into the Garden of Eden and then he formed the beasts of the field and the fowls of the air. Hadn't he already done this? On the earth, yes, but not in the Garden of Eden so that this new man, Adam would not be alone. Then he formed Eve.

Here you should note that the scripture refers to Adam being FORMED of the dust of the ground not CREATED. The original translation says 'formed in a flesh body on the face of the earth'. Confusing? Not really. Look in LUKE 3:23-38. Verse 38 being the most important. Luke traces the genealogy of Jesus Christ.

LUKE 3:38
   Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, WHICH WAS THE SON OF GOD.

It is very clear. Adam was the son of God. Pre-Adamic man was a higher form of animal. God gave him dominion over the other animals, but as far as the rest of scripture is concerned, this pre-Adamic man, was little better than a dog. Call them cave men, neanderthals, call them what you will, they were created thousands of years before Adam. So already we have two separate species, man and the bloodline or seedline of Adam who was the son of God.

Multiregionalism vs Single Origin (4.66 / 3) (#40)
by finn on Thu Sep 27th, 2001 at 07:24:50 AM PST
I'm sorry to tell you, but the evidence for the multiregional origin of humanity has already been discounted by the relevant authorities (Stringer & McKie et al). Walthorpe's rantings have long been viewed with amusement by those in the know - he just won't let go of his pet theory.

You might as well face it - your racist views went out of style with the disgrace of Coon. We are all one people.

Hang up your pointy hat, put away the brands, and move into the 20th Century. We'll wait for you.

lookout, son (5.00 / 1) (#42)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu Sep 27th, 2001 at 09:46:44 AM PST
I'm sorry to tell you, but the evidence for the multiregional origin of humanity has already been discounted by the relevant authorities (Stringer & McKie et al).
I took a class taught by Milford Wolpoff, Stringer's foil. He'd gut you with a hand-axe if he heard you saying shit like this. Of course, he looks like an archaic homo sapien so it's prolly in his own interest to prove that he's as evolved as the rest of us..

Such is life (5.00 / 1) (#45)
by finn on Fri Sep 28th, 2001 at 01:27:32 AM PST
"He'd gut you with a hand-axe if he heard you saying shit like this."
Don't know why, Stringer and McKie and the rest I can't find my bibliography to name _have_ discounted Multiregionalism.

Only just found a picture of him; ----. Does look a bit primitive.

Didn't think anyone would actually know what I was talking about - teach me for making assumptions.

When Goths Ask For Peace (none / 0) (#53)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Oct 3rd, 2001 at 01:49:50 PM PST
For those bereft of a sense of humour, I ought to interject at this point on behalf of the black-clad brethren referred to as 'Goths'.

Goth is a global phenomenon. The most famous Goths - Siouxsie Sioux, Andrew Eldritch and Wayne Hussey - are British. You'll find Goths in every nation, culture, land and workplace.

Some Goths are Pagan. Some Goths are Catholic, Church of England, Bhuddist or Hindu. Some Goths are atheist, others merely agnostic. The one sure way to spot a Goth is to witness the lanky bloke running away from a fight because he doesn't want to break his nails.

The origins of the word 'scapegoat' go thousands of years back - possibly originating in the Old Testament. The origins of 'Goth' as popular culture go back as far as 1970s Bromley when some doleite read one too many Mary Shelley novels.

Goths DO typically fit the 'scapegoat' mould, though - most memorably in the wake of the Columbine massacre when (amongst others) KMFDM were blamed for the atrocity.

Sadly, given current events, the German rock group KMFDM were somewhat precogniscent when in 1995 they penned the following lyrics:

"Terrorists.. are responsible for the violence... how much longer will we tolerate mass murder... we shall use all peaceful means to overcome tyranny... persist, and move on... regardless of race, gender or social status we are all affected"
['Terror' from the 'Nihil' album]

Funny how often the scapegoat is the only person talking sense...

*hugs to all affected by the WTC tragedy*


Goths in every country? (5.00 / 1) (#56)
by jsm on Thu Oct 4th, 2001 at 09:38:01 AM PST
You'll find Goths in every nation, culture, land and workplace

Oh yeh? Find me one in Bhutan.

Goths DO typically fit the 'scapegoat' mould, though - most memorably in the wake of the Columbine massacre when (amongst others) KMFDM were blamed for the atrocity.

Exactly. And we haven't had another school massacre since. This a proven technique I'm tlaking about here.

... the worst tempered and least consistent of the editors
... now also Legal department and general counsel,

School killings (none / 0) (#58)
by Hagbard Celine on Tue Oct 9th, 2001 at 02:05:17 PM PST

I find it interesting that you co-opt (or agree with) the logic that goths were responsible for the school massacre at Columbine. Blame it on the music. Blame it on playing Quake. Blah. I'm disappointed in you, your previous posts have been of a much higher caliber. (This is not a flame) As someone who has killed literally millions of virtual people in violent games I laugh at that idea. And there have been further murders at school, they just haven't been as big or as organized. However, I think you're all right, we should scapegoat the goths.

goths and the WTC (none / 0) (#54)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Oct 3rd, 2001 at 02:05:50 PM PST
Sorry I cannot agree with you points about this.
Goths are not responsible for what happened in the USA, goths as I know them are people who dress a particular way and listen to a style of music, and are pretty open minded individuals. Most goths I know are not actually pagans and do not practice any form of religion, although some i know also are christian.
Basically Goth is about a style of music and clothes, in the same way as someone who listens to Britney Spears and buys Gucci clothes, is prehaps a trendy. It has nothing to do with religion but more to do with alternative fashion and music. And while i am here, not all goths are unemployed or drop outs - I know people who are into the goth scene who are, mums and dads, managing directors, social workers, nurses, teachers, in the IT industry, highly skilled and very highly paid people, etc.
Your argument made absolutly no sense! why scapegoat a group of people who listen to music that you would not listen to, and wear clothes you would not neccersarily wear, for something that was the action of international terrosist, and how can you say that any of us have anything in common with that lunatic Bin Laden?
I am so glad that you fall into the minority, and the vast majority of people would not agree with you. Thank goodness you are not in charge. You are no better than Adolf Hitler, and the things you have said are highly dangerous and could result in harm to innocent people.
Please go and sort your self out, the world has one to many fascists in it.
Debbie (UK)

duh (none / 0) (#57)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu Oct 4th, 2001 at 08:29:28 PM PST
Goths are not responsible for what happened in the USA

But that's precisely the point! Remember, this is a proposal to find scapegoats for the attacks, not responsible parties. And who better for serving the role of a scapegoat than the people whose belief system actually accepts the notion? It would be unjust to scapegoat a group that doesn't believe in it.

Stupidity is the US's main export (none / 0) (#55)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu Oct 4th, 2001 at 03:10:55 AM PST
Your only god is the dollar, fat american fools.
You obviously know nothing of religion (look up what that word actually means in the dictionary).

I propose that your stupid ruling class (ie your corporations and their puppet, the Shrub) be held responsible for the WTC attacks.

disturbing. just disturbing. you sick freak. (none / 0) (#60)
by thechild on Sun Jan 20th, 2002 at 08:30:05 PM PST
aa!!! he wants to kill me!!! i'm afraid!!!

We are all the children of.... (none / 0) (#61)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jun 24th, 2002 at 12:15:33 AM PST
of our parents. Sorry, I don't believe that some "almighty being" made 2 people who made more children. I mean, they committed incest. Isn't that against your bible? What hypocritical shit. And just so you know... Islamics do not believe in adam and eve.....



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